"TRANSFER OF INMATES TO THE BERNBURG EUTHANASIA STATION FOR EXTERMINATION.
"9. I became aware in 1941 that the so-called 'Euthanasia' program for the extermination of the mentally and physically deficient was being carried out in Germany. At that time the Camp Commander, Koch, called all the important SS officials of the camp together and informed them that he had received secret order from Himmler to the effect that all mentally and physically deficient inmates of the camp should be killed. The camp commander stated the higher authorities from Berlin ordered that all Jewish inmates of the Buchenwald Concentration Camp should be included in this extermination program. In accordance with these orders 300 to 400 Jewish prisoners of different nationalities were sent to the 'Euthanasia Station' at Bernburg for extermination. A few days later I received a list of the names of these Jews who were exterminated at Bernburg from the camp commander and was ordered to issue falsified statements of death. I obeyed this order. This particular action was executed under the code name '14 f 13'. I visited Bernburg on one occasion to arrange for the cremation of two inmates who died in the Wernigerode Branch of the Buchenwald Concentration Camp.
"THE KILLING OF INMATES BY PHENOL AND OTHER MEANS.
"10. In the camp we had a great many prisoners who were jealous of the positions held by a certain few of the inmates, that is, some of political prisoners held key positions and were able to get better living conditions than the average. Hence, many of the prisoners envied these positions and made every effort to discredit the men who held the key positions. Such traitorous actions became known through the 'grapevine' to the men in the key positions and then such traitors were immediately killed. In each case I was later notified in order to make out the death statements of the prisoners killed. These statements did not indicate the actual cause of death, but were made out to indicate that the prisoner died of natural causes.
"11. In some instances I supervised the killing of these unworthy inmates by injections of phenol at the request of the inmates. These killings took place in the camp hospital and I was assisted by several inmates.
On one occasion Dr. Ding came to the hospital to witness such killings with phenol and said that I was not doing it correctly; therefore, he performed some of the injections himself. At that time three inmates were killed with phenol injections and they died within a minute.
"12. The total number of traitors killed was about 150, of whom 60 were killed by phenol injections, either by myself or under my supervision in the camp hospital, and the rest were killed by various means, such as beatings by the inmates. (Signed) Dr. Waldemar Hoven."
While we are now dealing in particular with the typhus experiments conducted at Buchenwald, the Court has seen that this affidavit also covers in part the Euthanasia program and we have just heard the witness Ferdinand Holl testify as to the action "f-13" and you will recall that the witness Walter Neff also testified to the action "f-13", which were described in both instances as the invalid transports sent from the concentration camps to the extermination centers; and here again we find the defendant Hoven explaining to us the meaning of the code name "14-f-13".
It is our position, of course, that the actions known to Neff and Ferdinand Holl as "f-13" were in effect the same as the action "14-f-13" and we have seen from all these sources that through this action, persons of all nationalities who were considered to be invalids and unfit for work were exterminated under the German Euthanasia Program. The other portion of the affidavit dealing with matters other than the typhus experiments, is Hoven's rather pathetic description of the part he personally played in the killing of some one hundred and fifty inmates who he has described as traitors to the good inmates of the concentration camp.
Part of the affidavit dealing with typhus experiments at Buchenwald gives us a thumb-nail picture of the beginning of this program and under whose jurisdiction it was carried out, that is, the immediate jurisdiction. We saw that it began in the latter part of 1941 in Block 46 of the Buchenwald Concentration Camp and that at that time it was directly under the supervision of Ding who in turn was subordinated to Mrugowsky who was the chief of the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS in Berlin, and that Mrugowsky in turn was subordinated to the defendant Genzken who was chief of the Medical Service of the Waffen SS, part of which was the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS; and the Tribunal will recall during our presentation on the organization of the SS that in August of 1943 a shift in subordination took place and at that time Mrugowsky and the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS were transferred under Dr. Grawitz who was the Reichsarzt SS.
However, from late 1941 until 1943 the chain of command as, as I described in the affidavit, first Genzken, Mrugowsky and then Ding. Hoven tells us how the inmates were selected, who were selected first by him and then screened by Schober and then passed on to Ding, and he very clearly states they were selected at random and, of course, were therefore not volunteers.
I pass now to document NO 423 which I offer conditionally as Prosecution Exhibit No. 282.
DR. FLEMMING: Counsel Flemming for the defendant Mrugowsky. I object to the presentation of this document for two reasons. I should like to emphasize that my objection may have the same reservation about any future document as it was ruled by the High Tribunal with reference to the previous affidavit; I object firstly because this affidavit has the contents of an interrogation of the defendant Mrugowsky and at the same time of the defendant Genzken and it is summarizing both these interrogations. I am of the opinion that such a common interrogation of two defendants has to be taken down on record and I think that it is not admissible to interrogate one of these two defendants and ask him to submit an affidavit about the result of these interrogations. In addition, the defendant Mrugowsky neither during this common interrogation with Genzken nor before making the affidavit nor before signing that affidavit, was informed as to what extent he had the right to refuse making that testimony. Finally, this affidavit was sworn to in front of a civilian, so that the same statements apply to it that were made previously and repeatedly by the High Tribunal in other cases.
THE PRESIDENT: The objection will be overruled and the affidavit admitted provisionally, subject to the later attack on the part of the defendant's counsel and subject to the proper certification appearing of the person who purported to take the oath of the witness. The ruling of the Tribunal is without prejudice to the right of counsel later to renew his motion against the affidavit.
JUDGE SWEARINGEN: Mr. McHaney, in Document 423, affidavit of defendant Mrugowsky, the certificate of translation refers to defendant Viktor Brack on Page 9 of my document book.
MR. McHANEY: It refers to what, your Honor?
JUDGE SWEARINGEN: It refers to the affidavit by Viktor Brack; the certificate placed on this affidavit of Mrugowsky refers to the affidavit of Viktor Brack.
MR. McHANEY: You are correct, your Honor; and we shall also rectify that. Obviously there has been a mistake made there because even the date of the affidavit does not conform to the one which we were forced to translate, so we will check back and ascertain who did in fact translate this document and have the proper certificate substituted.
THE PRESIDENT: This affidavit will also be received subject to the correction on the part of the certificate for translation.
MR. McHANEY: This document is an affidavit taken from the defendant Mrugowsky; and it reads as follows:
"I, Joachim Ernst Albert Mrugowsky, being duly sworn, depose and state:
"1. I was born in Rathenow, Germany, on August 15, 1905; and from 1925 to 1931 studied medicine and natural science, especially biology, at the University of Halle. In 1931 I passed my state examination. From 1935 until the collapse of Germany I was in active service of medical officer of the Waffen SS. I rose gradually in the ranks of the Waffen SS and was promoted to Oberfuehrer in 1943. In the Waffen SS I was chief of the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS and chief of tho Office XVI "Hygiene" in the operational main office. On September 1, 1943, this institute was put immediately under the Reich Physician SS and Police Dr. Ernst Grawitz; and I became chief of office III on the staff of the Reich Physician SS and Police.
I entered the NSDAP on March 1, 1930, and the SS on 15 October 1931. My party number is Number 210049 and my SS number is Number 25811. I received my doctor's degree for Hygiene and Bacteriology in 1937 at the University of Halle. In 1939 I became a lecturer for this field of science at the University in Berlin and was appointed professor of this university in 1944.
"2. By reason of my position as Chief Hygiene Officer of the Waffen SS and Chief of Amt XVI in the SS operational Main Office and later of the Office III in the staff of the Reich physician SS and Police, I obtained full knowledge of the position and activities of Dr. Karl Genzken and of the position and work of Dr. Edwin Ding, who was Chief of the Department for Spotted Fever and Virus Research at the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS at the Buchenwald Concentration Camp. Several times I received reports to which charts were attached from Dr. Ding indicating the results of the experiments carried out there; and I reported on these matters to Dr. Genzken, an occasion which shall be described later. I visited the above-named department in the Buchenwald Concentration Camp several times. Supervision of the research and the manufacture of spotted fever vaccine carried out there was part of my scope of duties.
"3. Due to my position I gained complete knowledge of the official connection between Dr. Genzken and Dr. Ding. Therefore, I am able to make this statement on that subject.
"4. Genzken was my immediate superior from 1940 until September 1, 1943. At that time a reorganization of the SS Medical Service was carried out and I was placed directly under Dr. Grawitz, then Reich Physician SS and Police. In the beginning of 1942 Dr. Genzken ordered the foundation of the Department for Spotted Fever and Virus Research at the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS in the Buchenwald Concentration Camp and appointed Dr. Ding as Chief of this department. As I was at that time Chief of Amt XVI "Hygiene" in the SS Operational Main Office, I was the immediate superior of Dr. Ding.
The name of his department was chosen in order to make clear the similar purposes of this Institute for the Waffen SS and of the Institute for Spotted Fever and Virus Research of the OKH (Supreme Army Command) in Cracow under Dr. Major Eyer.
"5. Dr. Genzken knew, as a matter of course, that the Institute was founded for the purpose of providing the Waffen SS with an efficient vaccine against spotted fever. In the Department for Spotted Fever and Virus Research at Buchenwald, medical experiments on inmates of the Buchenwald Concentration Camp were carried out by Dr. Ding in order to determine the effect of various spotted fever vaccines.
"6. In April 1943 I made an oral report to Dr. Genzken on the results of experiments carried out thus far. In this report I gave the necessary explanations and showed Dr. Genzken some charts which were sent to me by Dr. Ding's office and which indicated the fever and pulse curves, the dates of the vaccination and artificial infection, the death rates, complication which arose, etc. One of the experimental series shown in the charts was carried out on people who were only infected but not vaccinated in order to find out the potency of the vaccines used in other cases.
"7. I made a complete report to Dr. Genzken; and it is, therefore, absolutely impossible that Genzken as a doctor should have been ignorant of the fact that human beings ware used for these experiments and research.
"Signed, Dr. Mrugowsky."
Indeed, I think it can safely be said that the Institute at Buchenwald could have had no purpose other that the testing of vaccines prior to the time that Block 50 war set up early in 1943 because it was then at Block 50 that the vaccines were manufactured. Prior to that time the experiments were carried out on inmates with vaccines supplied from other sources so of course there was really no purpose nor function to this spotted fever and virus at Buchenwald prior to 1943 other than the testing on human beings of various vaccines. In other words, it was not a vaccine manufacturing institute; and this affidavit of the defendant Mrugowsky makes it clear that the defendant Genzken was in the direct chain of command and had full information concerning the criminal activities at Buchenwald, at least prior to September, 1943.
I come now to Document Number
THE PRESIDENT: We will consider no more documents this evening. The Tribunal desires to announce that it has under consideration the matter suggested the other day by one of the defense counsel in connection with the taking of affidavits to be used as evidence in the case; and an announcement will be made by the Tribunal concerning the method to be followed in connection with such a matter, probably Monday morning.
The Tribunal will now recess until 9:30 o'clock Monday morning.
Official transcript of the American Military Tribunal in the matter of the United States of America, against Karl Brandt, et al, defendants, sitting at Nurnberg, Germany, on 6 January 1947, 0930, Justice Beals, presiding.
THE MARSHAL: The Honorable Judges of Military Tribunal 1.
Military tribunal 1 is now in session.
God save the United States of America and this Honorable Tribunal.
There will be order in the courtroom.
THE PRESIDENT: Mr. Marshal, ascertain that the defendants are all present in the court.
THE MARSHAL: May it please your Honor, all defendants are present in the courtroom.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary-General will note for the record the fact that all the defendants are present in court.
This afternoon the Tribunal will recess probably at 3:30 o'clock in order to go into consultation to consider the matter suggested last week by several defense counsel in connection with the matter of procuring affidavits and depositions by the defendants. The Tribunal desires at that time that the prosecution be represented by one or two of its staff and that the defendants counsel be also represented. As that matter was first suggested by Dr. Servatius and second by Dr. Sauter, those gentlemen will be present at the conference. The defense counsel themselves will choose another representative so that three of defense counsel will be present at that conference.
The prosecution may proceed.
The conference will be held in the Judges' consultation room. At this time I would request the Marshal that there are available for that conference one interpreter who interprets from German into English and one interpreter to interpret from English into German.
MR. McHANEY: May it please the Tribunal, at the end of the session on Friday we were considering evidence with respect to the typhus experi ments carried out at the Buchenwald Concentration Camp.
The prosecution wishes to call at the earliest available opportunity this morning the witness Henri-Jean Grandjean to testify with respect to the mustard gas experiments at Natzweiler. However, there will be an unavoidable delay because of the difficulty of arranging for French interpretation; however, I understand that will be straightened out rather shortly and I hope that we will be able to present Monsieur Grandjean at some time, at least shortly after the morning recess. In the meantime, I should like to continue with the presentation of proof on the typhus experiments at Buchenwald and I now offer Document NO 257 as prosecution Exhibit 283. This is on page 10 of the English document book.
DR. GAWLIK (For the defendant HOVEN): The Tribunal, The Document NO 257, I ask that it not be admitted for the following reasons. I should like to call the attention of the Tribunal to page 12 of the English Document Book. Under the first signature, Dr. Schuler, it says, "This statement was written by me on three (3) pages on typewriter in Freising, Germany, on the 20 July 1945 at 1400 hours, voluntarily and without force." Then it goes on, "I swear by God, the Almighty, that I will withhold nothing, Dr. Erwin Schuler." Further, what follows, first is the translation. Apparently only a written statement was given that he was taking the oath but aside from exceptional cases which are not the case here, an oath can be given orally and, furthermore, there is no indication that the oath was administered by a person who had the authority to administer such oath. Thus there is no real oath in this case. Furthermore, I should like to point out that the last notation sworn to on the 19th of December 1945 must refer to the translation because on the 19th of December 1945 Ding was already dead.
MR. McHANEY: If the Tribunal please, this is another case where the translation department has omitted to include the certification which appears on the original document. It is unfortunate the document mitigates against the admissibility of this affidavit sworn to by Dr. Erwin Schuler. The Tribunal will see from the original which I have before me that it is signed Erwin Schuler on the bottom, on the back of the document is the translation -- the translation department obviously didn't turn it over.
There appears again the signature of Erwin Schuler and immediately underneath that is "Subscribed and sworn to before me at Freising, Germany, this 20th day of July 1945," signed George P. Swanick, Captain, Infantry, Investigating Officer. As I was saying, on the original a certification does appear by George P. Swanick, and it reads: "Subscribed and sworn to before me at Freising, Germany, this 20th day of July 1945." Signed, George P. Swanick, Captain, Infantry, Investigating Officer.
As has been pointed out by defense counsel, the certification which appears on the translation deals with the translation of this document. It was translated by one Harry Ilsen in the first instance. He was sworn by one Fred W. Hofstetter, Captain, Infantry, at Dachau, Germany. That deals with the translation. We must admit that the affidavit is in good order and should be admitted.
THE PRESIDENT: Counsel will exhibit the original affidavit to defense counsel and then pass it to the Tribunal.
DR. GAWLIK: If the Tribunal please, I have seen that the original contains a notation which is not included in the translation. Therefore, I withdraw this reason for my objection. My objection against the affidavit I will explain as follows: The person who made this affidavit is dead. In 1945 he committed suicide. Everyone who makes an affidavit can be crossexamined by the opposing body, in the first place in order to supplement the affidavit and in the second place to check the credibility of the individual. Only on an affidavit in which the person concerned can be cross-examined is there full evidential value and can therefore be considered as admissible. This is not the case in the case of this affidavit and I therefore consider the submission of this affidavit inadmissible for this reason.
MR. McHANEY: If the Tribunal please, it occurs to me that the fact that the affiant is no longer available is a very strong reason why the Document should be admitted. I can assure the Tribunal that if he were living and available, he would be sitting in the dock before the Tribunal, but he is now dead and cannot be called here either for direct or crossexamination. The only evidence of his which we have left is contained in this affidavit, which we are now presenting to the Tribunal. I may also say that the position of the defense counsel seems to work both ways. When we have a living affiant and an objection is made to the admissibility of the Document, the witness can be called before the Tribunal. On the other hand, if the affiant is dead, we urge that the Document be made admissible because he cannot be called here. The Prosecution respectfully requests that this Document be admissible. I may add that the statements made herein by the deceased Dr. Ding are amply sustained and substantiated by a considerable amount of document evidence which will come before the Tribunal.
THE PRESIDENT: The objection of the defense counsel is overruled. What was the number of the exhibit?
MR. MC HANEY: This is prosecution exhibit No. 283. It reads as follows:
Freising, 20 July 1945 "As ordered I answer two questions literally:
"1. Witness at an Euthanasy with Phenol at Buchenwald.
"At the end of 1942 I took part at a conference in the Military Doctors Academy in Berlin. The topic of discussion was the fatality of gasburn serum on wounded.
"Attendants: General Dr. Prof. Schreiber, Mil. Academy, Hygienist SS Brig. Gen. Prof. Mrugowsky, Hygienist A medical officer who was unknown to me who was a surgeon Myself as section leader of the Centralinstitution in Berlin for fighting of epidemics.
"Killion and Mrugowsky gave reports of soldiers who had received Gaseedomasorum in high quantities (up to 1500 cc) and hours afterwards, out of complete recuperation, died suddenly without any visible reason. Mrugowsky suspected that the Phenol content brought about the fatal result of the consolidation of the separate injections.
"In the presence of the other gentlemen, Mrugowsky commanded me to take part in a Euthanasy with phenol in a concentration camp and to describe the result in detail since neither I nor Mrugowsky ever saw a case of death through Phenol. Mrugowsky himself could not take part in the Euthanasy because of an urgent trip to the East, on the other hand the affair was important for the fighting troops and the publication of another circular for the troop doctors.
"Few days later I asked Dr. Hoven in Buchenwald to notify me when he would perform another Euthanasy with Phenol. The next evening he asked me to the hospital block in the prison building. Besides himself and another doctor - probably Dr. Plaza - only two other prison male nurses, whom I cannot remember, were present.
"I talked with the doctor about the composition of the Phenol injection and, as far as I can remember, it consisted of undiluted raw phenol, which was to be administered in 20cc quantities.
"One by one 4 or 5 prisoners were led in. The upper part of the body was naked so that the nationality patch could not be distinguished. The condition of the bodies was bad and the age was high. I do not remember a diagnosis as to why the Euthanasy should take place but probably did not ask for one either.
"They sat down on a chair quietly, that is, without emotion, near a light. A male nurse blocked the vein in the arm and Dr. Hoven injected the Phenol quickly. Still during the injection they died in a momentary total cramp without any sign of other pain. The time between the beginning of the injection and the fatal result I estimate at about 1/2 second. For security reasons, the rest of the dose was injected, although part of the injection would have been enough for the fatal result (I estimate 5 cc.).
"The dead were carried into an adjoining room by the nurses - the time of my presence and witness I estimate at 10 minutes. According to orders I reported to Berlin. I know nothing further to say.
"2. Hoven's share in Block 46.
"In February 1942 the order to conduct typhus experiments came through. I was chosen to carry out these experiments. Since I had my office in Berlin, a deputy had to be appointed for my absence in Buchenwald. For this post the Reichsarzt SS Dr. Grawitz in agreement with the leading doctor of the Concentration Camps Lolling named the SS 1st Lt. Dr. Hoven as station doctor at Buchenwald.
"My presence in Buchenwald lasting always only a few days while the time of the experiments and the length of the typhus epidemic lasted about ten weeks.
"Dr. Hoven had the order to get the prisoners (professional criminals sentenced to death), that have been released for the experiments from the Reich security office and the Chief of the Concentration Camps, ready for the vaccination or the infection after an examination of their physical fitness.
"As deputy, he often order Dr. Plaza to take over the guard of Block 46. Dr. Plaza in addition continued to work independently under Capo Dietzsch.
"For experiments that did not result in fatality, such as the compatibility of Yellow Fever Vaccine, 2-300 volunteers stood in readiness as I know from rosters that Dietzsch showed me once. Such experiments did not only take place in the block but also, in a certain case, in the camp itself.
For that experiment about 80 Dutchmen were taken, they did not have to work and they were given extra rations. For that they had to have their temperature taken three times daily and every two days had to give 10 cc blood for a blood count.
"Hoven worked as my deputy until my permanent entrance in Buchenwald in August 1943. In September he was arrested.
"In the year 1942 he had to work a lot by himself since I contracted typhus and after that was sent to a resthome. Right after that I had a detail to the Pasteur Institution in Paris. During this time the sick reports carried the signature of Hoven or Plaza."
(signed) Dr. Schuler "This statement was written by me on three (3) pages on typewriter in Freising, Germany, on 20 July 1945 at 1400 hours, voluntarily and without force.
"I swear by God, the Almighty, that I will say nothing but the pure truth, and will add and withhold nothing."
(signed) Dr. Edwin Schuler.
The first part of this affidavit, of course, deals with the murder of a number of prisoners with phenol; and, of course, they made that very amazing and wonderful discovery -- that you can kill a man with phenol in less that one second. It is interesting to note, however, that Doctor Ding tells us that this was carried out on the orders, and after a consultation between Professor Schreiber of the Military Medical Academy in Berlin, and the defendant Mrugowsky And, I will remind the Tribunal that Schreiber was one of the principal subordinates of the defendant Handloser. Handloser was, in fact, what you might call the Chief of the Military Medical Academy by virtue of his position as Chief of the Medical Inspectorate of the Army. And, so we see that one of his principal subordinates, that is, to say, Handloser's subordinates, is urging the execution of a number of people in an effort to determine the effect of this gas-burn serium on wounded people, which apparently was a matter of some interest to the Armed Forces.
The second part of the affidavit deals with the activities of the defendant Hoven in Block 46 at Buchenwald; and it was in Block 46 that the typhus experiments, themselves, were actually carried out. It was there that the vaccines were administered, and later artificial injections, through injections, or through the bites of lice, was also done, And we see that Hoven was Ding's principal subordinate, and was in charge of Block 46 when Ding was away on trips to Berlin or to the Pasteur Institute in Paris.
THE PRESIDENT: You refer to Doctor Ding, do you mean Ding or Schuler?
MR. McHANEY: I am sorry, your Honor, Ding is Doctor Schuler. The man's name was Ding up until, I think, sometime in 1944, whereupon he secured permission of the appropriate agency in the Reich government to change it to Schuler. It is a rather interesting story, but I think I will wait and have one of our witnesses tell the Tribunal when this was done.
Schuler also tell us that Hoven, in fact, selected or secured the prisoners who were experimented upon with typhus. And, of course, Hoven also administered the phenol injections which killed the five unfortunate people, and he has admitted as much in his own a affidavit.
I am advised at this time that the interpreters are prepared to interpret into Franch-
JUDGE SEBRING: The Tribunal has a question. Mr. McHaney, I seem to lose the significance of this affidavit. The first part of it deals with euthanasia with phenol at Buchenwald, and the defendant Mrugowsky is named in the affidavit Now, is it your view that this affidavit tends to show some culpability on the part of the defendant Mrugowsky in relation to the Euthanasia Program?
MR. McHANEY: I do not think that Mrugowsky is indicted as being a participant in the Euthanasia Program as such.
JUDGE SEBRING: That is the reason I propounded the question.
MR. McHANEY: However, I take it that the affidavit does incriminate Mrugowsky in murder, if nothing more. In other words, the way this was brought about, was, that Mrugowsky and Schuler had a discussion about the effect of gasburn serium on the wounded, and as a result of this, Mrugowsky suspected that the phenol contents of the serium had something to do with the fatal results that they were experiencing; and, that was the reason Schuler was ordered to -in fact, execute four people with phenol. And, that, as he states, was done. Now, while Mrugowsky is not formally indicted under the Euthanasia Program, I take it he is probably indicted for participating in the murders and atrocities through medical experimentations, and I take it that this proof falls within the scope of the affidavit with respect to Mrugowsky.
THE PRESIDENT: Is it your position Counsel that this affidavit conveys any information at all as to the nationality of these victims or phenol?
MR. McHANEY: If I understood the question, I do not think the affidavit does reveal the nationalities of the deceased victims. As he states, their nationality patches could not be observed because they were -- that portion of their bodies were naked. So, I take it that it probably could not and would not be assumed by the Tribunal that these people necessarily were non-German nationalities.
JUDGE SEBRING: Well, it is your view that this affidavit may tend to establish culpability as against the defendant Mrugowsky under the preliminary charges that are not particularized; mostly under Count 2 and Count 3, is that correct?
MR. McHANEY: Yes, indeed, the preliminary portion of paragraph 6, as I recall it.
JUDGE SEBRING: And, also 11.
MR. McHANEY: Yes, indeed, 11.
I am advised at this time, the interpreters are prepared to interpret from Franch into English and from English into German; so, at this time, the Prosecution would like to have the witness Henri-Jean Grandjean called to the stand.
THE PRESIDENT: The Marshal will summon the Prosecution's witness Henri-Jean Grandjean.
Henri-Jean Grandjean, a witness, took the stand and testified as follows:
BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q. Hold up your right hand. You will repeat the oath after me:
I swear by God, the Almighty and Omniscient, that I will speak the pure truth and will withhold and add nothing.
(The witness repeated the oath.)
Q. Now, I will administer the oath to the Interpreter. The interpreter will rise and raise her right hand, and repeat after me:
I, Margaret Abraham, do solemnly swear that I will perform my duty as interpreter to the Tribunal to the best of my ability and skill, so help me God.
(The interpreter repeated the oath).
The Prosecution will proceed with the examination of this witness.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. McHANEY:
Q. Your name is Henri-Jean Grandjean?
A. Yes.
Q. You are a French citizen?
A. Yes.
Q. Are you now residing at 13 Rue de Marivaux, Paris?
A. Yes.
Q. Witness, will you please tell the Tribunal what your present occupation is?
A. Administrator -- business manager.
Q. Are you an expert to some of the French courts?
A. Only for business matters.
Q. Now, witness, did there come a time in 1943 when you were arrested?
A. In November 1943.
Q. By whom were you arrested, witness?
A. The Security Police.
Q. The German Security Police?
A. Yes, the German Security Police.
Q. Why were you arrested, witness?
A. As an officer in the French Army -- as a fighting officer, I was arrested, as a French military.
Q. Were you an officer in the so-called FFC?
A. Yes.
Q. And, that was a resistance movement, I take it?
A. Yes; we had a special task in France.
Q. Now, what happened to you as a result of this arrest? Were you given a trial?
A. I was tortured by the Gestapo in Paris; later I was sent to Reims for two months.
DR. SERVATIUS: Mr. President, may I make a technical suggestion? The interpreter is translating incorrectly there, and is not repeating the words of the witness. Would it be possible for the witness to speak loud enough so we can understand him in French -- to be able to check the French. If the microphone could be moved over a little, the interpreter is speaking too low as if she was carrying on a private conversation.
THE PRESIDENT: The witness will speak louder and into the microphone. The interpreter will also speak in a little louder tone.
BY MR. McHANEY:
Q. I had just asked whether or not you were tried by any court because of your participation in the resistance movement?
A. I was arrested in 1943. I was arrested by the Security Police in Paris. I was subjected to a very severe interrogation for eight days. Later I was transferred to Rheims, but I was kept in custody for two months. I might add that I suffered very much because an attempt was made to make me betray my comrades. On the 2nd of January 1944, I was transferred to the Natzweiler Extermination Camp?.
Q. Were you ever tried, witness, by a court?
A. No.
Q. And, you were sent to the Natzweiler Concentration Camp in January 1944
A. On the 2nd or 4th of January 1944.
Q. What work did you perform in the Natzweiler Camp?
A. I did various kinds of work. I was a ground worker. I built walls for the V-1; and, in April I entered the infirmary as a medical assistant.
Q. Well, were you ever tried, witness, by a court, or were you just....
A No.
Q. And you were sent to the Natzweiler Concentration Camp in January 1944, is that correct.
A. On the 2d or 4th of January 1944.
Q. What work did you perform in the Natzweiler Camp?
A. I did various kinds of work, I was a ground worker, I built walls for the V-I, and in April I entered the infirmary as a medical assistant.
Q. You were a male nurse in the infirmary?
A. Yes, I was a male nurse
Q. Were you able to observe whether or not any medical experiments were carried out at Natzweiler?
A. Sometimes.
Q. Do you know whether any experiments with mustard or Lost gas were performed on concentration camp inmates at Natzweiler?
A. Yes, in this regard I was assigned to Block 5 to take temperatures and pulses of 5 persons who had been in a gas chamber and who had survived.
Q. How were you able to talk to these 5 survivors about what had happened to them?
A. Yes, I was able to talk to one or two of them
Q. And what did they tell you had happened to them?
A. One of the survivors was a gypsy and he told me that he had been taken with 15 of his comrades and put into a gas chamber for experiments at Struthof. The SS gave him capsules which they were to break when a sign was given from outside. After some time the door was opened and the 5 survivors were brought for observation to Block 5, Room 2. I was told to take their temperatures three times a day.
Q. Now do you know what happened to the other 10 persons who were experimented on with gas?
A. They had died.
Q. How do you know that they died?
A. Their surviving comrades said that they had died. Some of them were dissected by Dr. Bogartz from Brussels.